>Ministers from Giorgia Meloni’s government claimed the “absurd” policy was ideologically driven and required change to reflect the realities of the market.
>Adolfo Urso, the industry minister, added: “In an uncertain landscape, which is affecting the German automotive industry, clarity is needed to not let the European industry collapse.
And just for fun, here’s a quote from Ralph Nader, speaking in the documentary “Who Killed The Electric Car?” way back in 2006:
>There are all kinds of ways to bring politicians to their knees. Once the car companies get a long lead time, then they go to work, eroding, eroding. And than when the deadline is approaching they say they can’t do it and there are going to be terrible consequences.
iqisoverrated
Well, then the answer is obvious: Let it collapse.
Best thing that can happen to the planet.
AndAlsoTheTrees
Well, going on thinking like that will just deliver hell to the future generations, including our own children. Some people are so selfish.
TrollTollTony
Sure, the planet is burning and will become inhospitable for 90% of life on the planet, but what about fiat? Won’t anyone think of fiat!?!?
Screamingmonkey83
where are the tesla haters?
ZetaPower
Stellantis has dragged its feet for more than a decade and now threatens to be obliterated…..
Sure, bail them out AGAIN….
duke_of_alinor
No surprise there. Fossil fuels and legacy auto have enough confidence in their clout to not worry about maintaining ICE profits.
IMO they need to be shown that is wrong, profits should not be a reason to delay climate change mitigation.
CapRichard
Ours was already collapsing (except Ferrari and Lamborghini excellence) before the proposed ban, the motives are others.
It has been a downward trend since… Well for at least 20 years or so. Even without a ICE ban, it will still implode.
jznwqux
it will collapse anyway: the consumers will prefer chinese EV-s to italian petrol-cars.
HNBKsiek
By 2035 “the industry” would have had over 30 years to switch to making EVs. If they can’t figure it out in 30 years, while many startups like Tesla, Rivian and Lucid did it in 5 years, they deserve to go bankrupt.
HNBKsiek
By 2035 “the industry” would have had over 30 years to switch to making EVs. If they can’t figure it out in 30 years, while many startups like Tesla, Rivian and Lucid did it in 5 years, they deserve to go bankrupt.
aliendepict
Well you either have the government save you by postponing the ban and maybe you get 2-3 more years before complete collapse because you won’t be able to catch up to the non EU car brands. Or you just cowboy up and get that shit done so you don’t loose to Chinese and american startups.
MrKuub
“Risk industry collapse”? I’m sorry, is it because the Italian marques have been sitting on their ass and doing nothing?
Because for what its worth, BMW is succeeding massively in building EV’s people want and buy, whilst still making ICE and hybrids. Renault is going strongly as well, with now a ramp up towards “cheaper” EV’s as the R5, R4 and new Twingo.
Seems like its stalling for stalling sake again.
kossttta
Of course, Italy. As much as I love it, it’a country that’s in many ways stuck in the past.
kongweeneverdie
Pretty sure Ursula will support this.
Shivin302
No need to ban petrol cars. Just super tax them so that niche enthusiasts can still have one but 97% of the population gets an EV
dcdttu
It blows my mind how a false narrative from a car company can so easily sway a society that’s literally on the brink of global disaster because capitalism.
Alexandratta
Ah yes.
The very well known and stable Italian Car industry might collapse if they cannot continue to make their most Reliable and dependable ICE vehicles that Italy is known for…
Let me just, gently remove the Super-Car Category from the list and see their normal production vehicle statistics and…
Oh…. Oh dear.
enveraltin
Don’t just risk, let, nay, command the noisy polluting suckers to rot in hell.
araujoms
For the non-Europeans here: Italy has a neo-fascist government that resists doing anything about pollution and climate change. This is just the same bullshit they have always spewed.
anonchurner
A better idea would be to pause petrol car production for a few years
jcrestor
Just do it. I guarantee EVs will dominate nevertheless, but then there will be no European automakers anymore.
Yummy_Castoreum
There’s no way the US or Europe will be ready by that date. That’s just reality. Infrastructure progress in many areas has been pathetic, and it’s a bigger problem in countries where more people live in flats. Consumer resistance is real too.
In the end, I expect we’ll see maybe (maybe) one-third EV in Western countries by 2035. If the rest is hybrid and PHEV, that’s honestly not bad.
On the plus side for Europe, shorter driving distances and better public transport means they can get away with shorter range vehicles than the US, easing the transition cost wise for consumers (and resource wise for the planet).
Vamproar
They know they can’t compete with China in EVs.
Europe and the US had literally decades in terms of a head start and they blew it.
icy1007
No, they should accelerate the ban.
Bar50cal
I was in Milan last week and blown away by how the city had literally no EVs or EV infrastructure.
In Ireland EVs are everywhere, in the cities most new cars seem to be EVs. We complain about there not being enough EV infrastructure but every car park, office, street parking areas have charging, the motorway have charge points and super fast points are going up everywhere. There is are less and less reasons not to buy a EV in Ireland nowadays and I will get one next time I buy as it just makes economic sense as a buyer here due to upfront, long term cost and incentives.
In Milan it was like going back 10+ years to where our EV sales and infrastructure was. In 6 days I saw 2x BMW iX3s and 1 Fiat 500 EV in the city. I probably missed a few but overall that was what I noticed. Italy is in no way ready for the move to EVs and the government has clearly done nothing about it over the past decade.
Looking out my home window now I see more EVs and PHEVs than ICE cars on the street. In Milan you could walk around the city center for 20 mins and not see one!
In all my travels over the past few years in Europe to Spain, Germany, France, UK etc it was so noticeable how far behind Italy is.
DreadSeverin
We need to kill ourselves later to sell some cars now! How can you not let them do it?! Think about the poor cancerous sociopathic billionaires that feed off the entire human species like a zombie virus that are mandated to accelerate our end!
chicagoblue
Lol. Eat crow ICE boy
tom_zeimet
The Italian car industry is in deep trouble with or without EVs, **to blame EVs is simply a populist talking point.**
Stellantis has made the decision to drastically cut back car production in Italy with both the ICE and EV Alfa-Romeo Milano, Fiat 600, Jeep Avenger, Fiat Grande Panda and Fiat Tipo (pre-Stellantis) being built outside of Italy.
Reasonable-Mine-2912
I would say the not ready part is more related to the EV made in China. As is today, Europe automakers are in no position to compete with Chinese automakers. (By the way, Volvo is owned by a Chinese company.)
zavtra13
They’ve had plenty of time to figure this out, if they haven’t managed to do so then they deserve to fail.
taobaolover
Let them ban it, tired of ICE especially European cars. Ridiculous engineering, making things difficult to replace and high labor rates. EV puts fear in them with low maintenance. Dealers are pissed because they can’t rob our pockets like they used too.
Jonger1150
Imagine aliens landing on this planet 150 years from now.
Our co2 level are around 2000 ppm, and Detroit can grow coconut trees. 75% of the life is wiped out, and when they manage to ask us why everything below 40N is a wasteland….. we’ll have just one response.
JOBS.
HarryCumpole
Collapse would be a good thing. We need to stop backsliding on these commitments.
farticustheelder
If current management can’t adjust to a changing tech world they should be terminated for incompetence up to and including the boards of directors.
AMLRoss
Without reading, let me guess, luxury brands like Ferrari, Maserati, and Lamborghini want to keep making their cars because the rich keep buying them?
wagglefree
I was all about EV’s until I found out that Electric cars spontaneously combust in garages while charging at night while you sleep.
I am now of the camp that wants technology to solve the exhaust cleaning problem. So gasoline can be used cleanly. Also the tech is there to filter the Air with machines. Scale them up at the same time exhaust systems new technology companies work to crack the code on cleaning exhaust.
FleurOuAne
“We ‘ve done nothing and it is still too hard, we need to back down”
38 Comments
From the article:
>Italy has called for a review of the European Union’s 2035 [petrol car ban](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/01/19/ursula-van-der-leyens-eu-engine-ban-opposed-own-party/) amid fears it risked triggering the industry’s “collapse”.
>Ministers from Giorgia Meloni’s government claimed the “absurd” policy was ideologically driven and required change to reflect the realities of the market.
>Adolfo Urso, the industry minister, added: “In an uncertain landscape, which is affecting the German automotive industry, clarity is needed to not let the European industry collapse.
And just for fun, here’s a quote from Ralph Nader, speaking in the documentary “Who Killed The Electric Car?” way back in 2006:
>There are all kinds of ways to bring politicians to their knees. Once the car companies get a long lead time, then they go to work, eroding, eroding. And than when the deadline is approaching they say they can’t do it and there are going to be terrible consequences.
Well, then the answer is obvious: Let it collapse.
Best thing that can happen to the planet.
Well, going on thinking like that will just deliver hell to the future generations, including our own children. Some people are so selfish.
Sure, the planet is burning and will become inhospitable for 90% of life on the planet, but what about fiat? Won’t anyone think of fiat!?!?
where are the tesla haters?
Stellantis has dragged its feet for more than a decade and now threatens to be obliterated…..
Sure, bail them out AGAIN….
No surprise there. Fossil fuels and legacy auto have enough confidence in their clout to not worry about maintaining ICE profits.
IMO they need to be shown that is wrong, profits should not be a reason to delay climate change mitigation.
Ours was already collapsing (except Ferrari and Lamborghini excellence) before the proposed ban, the motives are others.
It has been a downward trend since… Well for at least 20 years or so. Even without a ICE ban, it will still implode.
it will collapse anyway: the consumers will prefer chinese EV-s to italian petrol-cars.
By 2035 “the industry” would have had over 30 years to switch to making EVs. If they can’t figure it out in 30 years, while many startups like Tesla, Rivian and Lucid did it in 5 years, they deserve to go bankrupt.
By 2035 “the industry” would have had over 30 years to switch to making EVs. If they can’t figure it out in 30 years, while many startups like Tesla, Rivian and Lucid did it in 5 years, they deserve to go bankrupt.
Well you either have the government save you by postponing the ban and maybe you get 2-3 more years before complete collapse because you won’t be able to catch up to the non EU car brands. Or you just cowboy up and get that shit done so you don’t loose to Chinese and american startups.
“Risk industry collapse”? I’m sorry, is it because the Italian marques have been sitting on their ass and doing nothing?
Because for what its worth, BMW is succeeding massively in building EV’s people want and buy, whilst still making ICE and hybrids. Renault is going strongly as well, with now a ramp up towards “cheaper” EV’s as the R5, R4 and new Twingo.
Seems like its stalling for stalling sake again.
Of course, Italy. As much as I love it, it’a country that’s in many ways stuck in the past.
Pretty sure Ursula will support this.
No need to ban petrol cars. Just super tax them so that niche enthusiasts can still have one but 97% of the population gets an EV
It blows my mind how a false narrative from a car company can so easily sway a society that’s literally on the brink of global disaster because capitalism.
Ah yes.
The very well known and stable Italian Car industry might collapse if they cannot continue to make their most Reliable and dependable ICE vehicles that Italy is known for…
Let me just, gently remove the Super-Car Category from the list and see their normal production vehicle statistics and…
Oh…. Oh dear.
Don’t just risk, let, nay, command the noisy polluting suckers to rot in hell.
For the non-Europeans here: Italy has a neo-fascist government that resists doing anything about pollution and climate change. This is just the same bullshit they have always spewed.
A better idea would be to pause petrol car production for a few years
Just do it. I guarantee EVs will dominate nevertheless, but then there will be no European automakers anymore.
There’s no way the US or Europe will be ready by that date. That’s just reality. Infrastructure progress in many areas has been pathetic, and it’s a bigger problem in countries where more people live in flats. Consumer resistance is real too.
In the end, I expect we’ll see maybe (maybe) one-third EV in Western countries by 2035. If the rest is hybrid and PHEV, that’s honestly not bad.
On the plus side for Europe, shorter driving distances and better public transport means they can get away with shorter range vehicles than the US, easing the transition cost wise for consumers (and resource wise for the planet).
They know they can’t compete with China in EVs.
Europe and the US had literally decades in terms of a head start and they blew it.
No, they should accelerate the ban.
I was in Milan last week and blown away by how the city had literally no EVs or EV infrastructure.
In Ireland EVs are everywhere, in the cities most new cars seem to be EVs. We complain about there not being enough EV infrastructure but every car park, office, street parking areas have charging, the motorway have charge points and super fast points are going up everywhere. There is are less and less reasons not to buy a EV in Ireland nowadays and I will get one next time I buy as it just makes economic sense as a buyer here due to upfront, long term cost and incentives.
In Milan it was like going back 10+ years to where our EV sales and infrastructure was. In 6 days I saw 2x BMW iX3s and 1 Fiat 500 EV in the city. I probably missed a few but overall that was what I noticed. Italy is in no way ready for the move to EVs and the government has clearly done nothing about it over the past decade.
Looking out my home window now I see more EVs and PHEVs than ICE cars on the street. In Milan you could walk around the city center for 20 mins and not see one!
In all my travels over the past few years in Europe to Spain, Germany, France, UK etc it was so noticeable how far behind Italy is.
We need to kill ourselves later to sell some cars now! How can you not let them do it?! Think about the poor cancerous sociopathic billionaires that feed off the entire human species like a zombie virus that are mandated to accelerate our end!
Lol. Eat crow ICE boy
The Italian car industry is in deep trouble with or without EVs, **to blame EVs is simply a populist talking point.**
Stellantis has made the decision to drastically cut back car production in Italy with both the ICE and EV Alfa-Romeo Milano, Fiat 600, Jeep Avenger, Fiat Grande Panda and Fiat Tipo (pre-Stellantis) being built outside of Italy.
I would say the not ready part is more related to the EV made in China. As is today, Europe automakers are in no position to compete with Chinese automakers. (By the way, Volvo is owned by a Chinese company.)
They’ve had plenty of time to figure this out, if they haven’t managed to do so then they deserve to fail.
Let them ban it, tired of ICE especially European cars. Ridiculous engineering, making things difficult to replace and high labor rates. EV puts fear in them with low maintenance. Dealers are pissed because they can’t rob our pockets like they used too.
Imagine aliens landing on this planet 150 years from now.
Our co2 level are around 2000 ppm, and Detroit can grow coconut trees. 75% of the life is wiped out, and when they manage to ask us why everything below 40N is a wasteland….. we’ll have just one response.
JOBS.
Collapse would be a good thing. We need to stop backsliding on these commitments.
If current management can’t adjust to a changing tech world they should be terminated for incompetence up to and including the boards of directors.
Without reading, let me guess, luxury brands like Ferrari, Maserati, and Lamborghini want to keep making their cars because the rich keep buying them?
I was all about EV’s until I found out that Electric cars spontaneously combust in garages while charging at night while you sleep.
I am now of the camp that wants technology to solve the exhaust cleaning problem. So gasoline can be used cleanly. Also the tech is there to filter the Air with machines. Scale them up at the same time exhaust systems new technology companies work to crack the code on cleaning exhaust.
“We ‘ve done nothing and it is still too hard, we need to back down”